When politicians do live interviews, even with friendly journalists, they sometimes slip up and tell the truth. This happened on Sunday, Sept. 8, when NBC News’s Kristen Welker asked Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-VT) if he still considered Vice President Kamala Harris a “progressive,” even though she has recently claimed to have abandoned her support for bans on fracking and private health insurance.

“I don’t think she’s abandoning her ideals,” Sanders replied. “I think she’s trying to be pragmatic and doing what she thinks is right in order to win the election.”