Chaffetz: I’m just getting started

Fresh off a short-lived bid to become speaker of the House, Chaffetz remains upbeat about his party’s future in the lower chamber now that Rep. Paul Ryan has stepped up to the plate. He also remains confident in friend and colleague Rep. Trey Gowdy, R-S.C., who has taken fire for his handling of the House Select Committee on Benghazi after months of keeping the probe out of the spotlight. Amid the congressional turmoil, Chaffetz previewed some “juicy” announcements to look out for from his committee in the coming weeks.

Washington Examiner: For the Oversight Committee, the IRS has been what it’s known for the past couple years. That was part of Darrell Issa’s legacy. But you haven’t seen it come up as much since you’ve become chairman. Is that something that the Oversight Committee is still investigating?

Chaffetz: If I had to give you a list of top priorities, the IRS is up here [holds hand up high]. And you’re going to see some things sooner rather than later. Just foreshadowing.

Well, what we had was a long period where the inspector general was doing their work. And then when they came back, we’ve had those hearings now twice with the inspector general, going through that very lengthy report, plus the other previous reports, that’s when we got to the point where we’re coming to a point where we’re going to issue something ourselves.

“If I had to give you a list of top priorities, the IRS is up here [holds hand up high],” Chaffetz said.

Examiner: When you take the IRS investigation out to its logical conclusion, what at this point are you examining?

Chaffetz: I sent a 30-page letter to the president in July that he has not yet responded to. He promised the American people that the White House would work hand-in-hand with the Congress and from my vantage point that has not happened. There needs to be some significant changes there. There are very serious allegations about the IRS and specifically the IRS commissioner for not complying with a subpoena, and I think you’ll see us take some decisive action.

Examiner: You have called for Commissioner John Koskinen to resign. Was there any one particular breaking point where you said, “Koskinen has to go?”

Chaffetz: He had a duly-issued subpoena and despite that subpoena, they destroyed documents. Imagine if you did that to the IRS. They would haul you into jail. And rightfully so. So we’re going to hold them accountable.

Examiner: As someone who has done similar work with respect to the Benghazi committee, how do you view the criticism of how Chairman Gowdy is conducting that investigation?

Chaffetz: Trey Gowdy is first class. He runs a professional organization. He’s done a wonderful job. At one point it was just myself and Trey Gowdy working on Benghazi issues. I was the first one to go into Tripoli, first member of Congress to go into Libya. I’ve been there twice. I spent a lot of time working on Benghazi and dealing with the stonewalling from the State Department, the Department of Defense and the White House. I know this subject exceptionally well.

And all Chairman Gowdy is trying to do is get to the truth, and I think he’s demonstrated that that’s his driving mantra: to get to the truth. And so, there’s nobody better than Trey Gowdy. I know they’re going to try to tear him apart, criticize this or that, but he’s doing it the way it’s supposed to be done.

“[T]here’s nobody better than Trey Gowdy. I know they’re going to try to tear him apart, criticize this or that, but he’s doing it the way it’s supposed to be done,” Chaffetz said.

Examiner: Oversight was one of the committees that did look at Benghazi before. Where did the oversight committee fall short, in your opinion, that requires the select committee to keep going?

Chaffetz: Because the administration continues to stonewall and not provide documents. Still, to this day, there is three years that have passed since the attack, they still have not certified that they have given all the documents to the select committee. And it’s a problem that we were running into at the oversight committee. They weren’t providing evidences, and they were failing to provide documents.

Just two weeks ago, the select committee finally got Ambassador [Chris] Stevens’ emails. And so that’s pretty stunning. We were delayed for months by the so-called Accountability Review Board, but we know what a sham that is, and so, but that’s the time to uncover and discover and realize that it was just a facade to cover up what really happened in Benghazi.

Examiner: When you came onto the committee, did you find that there was polarization from the previous leadership?

Chaffetz: Sure. Sure. I mean, that was one of my goals, to try to smooth that out and stay focused on the actual topic. No criticism of any specific person, or the previous chairman, I just do things a little bit differently. And we get consensus. The best piece of advice that I got when I got here was, “You can disagree, but don’t be disagreeable.” And we still get some hard-hitting yelling and screaming, but it’s not directed at anybody personally. It’s more focused on the witnesses and the frustration with the administration.

But, you know, [Rep.] Elijah Cummings [D-Md.] and I have done roughly 200 letters, I think, together at this point. He obviously disagrees with me on things like Planned Parenthood and others, but we’re hand in glove, for instance, on Secret Service. So it depends on the topic.

Examiner: With the Secret Service, you were the target of some activities. How have you responded to it, when you’re the target of this misconduct?

Chaffetz: Well they’re demonstrating why we were looking at the Secret Service in the first place. They have a deep-seated cultural problem there … and the shenanigans that have gone on are just totally and wholly unacceptable. I think what they did was intended to intimidate, and quite frankly, it was intimidating. We’re concerned about the breadth, the pervasive nature of this. Forty-five agents? Forty-five? That’s a huge amount of people. I’m a little too close to it at this point.

“They have a deep-seated cultural problem there … and the shenanigans that have gone on are just totally and wholly unacceptable,” Chaffetz said of the Secret Service.

Examiner: Do you have to recuse yourself because you are a part of what you’re investigating?

Chaffetz: Yeah. So for instance, when the inspector general came in to meet with us about this particular topic, I didn’t ask any questions. I pretty much turned the reins over to Trey Gowdy, who’s familiar with these types of issues and I wholly trust him. And as it relates directly to me, we’ll let Trey Gowdy lead out.

Examiner: Speaking of Gowdy, he is a member of the oversight committee. So is Cummings. And they seem to get along fine on the oversight committee. In fact, everyone seems to get along fine.

Chaffetz: Well thank you. That’s good. That’s a credit to our committee.

Examiner: But why do you think they’ve erupted so much on the Benghazi committee, but haven’t when they’re doing a similar type of work on the oversight committee?

Chaffetz: I can’t really speak to the Benghazi committee. I’d like to think that we are doing the right things and working in a good, solid, bipartisan way. Sometimes there’s more flailing and demonstrable waving of the arms when Democrats don’t have much material to work with. It’s just intended, I think, in the Benghazi committee, to be a bit of a distraction from the actual truth and facts. That’s my own personal opinion.

But I’m proud of the way we’re conducting the committee and I think we have created an atmosphere where most of what we do, it really isn’t partisan. It may be critical of the administration, but I’d like to think we’d be equally as critical of a Republican administration, which I hope we have a chance to demonstrate next year.

“I’m proud of the way we’re conducting the [Benghazi] committee and I think we have created an atmosphere where most of what we do, it really isn’t partisan,” Chaffetz said.

Examiner: What do you think is the most important investigation that you’ve led so far?

Chaffetz: I think what you’ll find is the Secret Service, the Office of Personnel Management and the Secret Service are probably the top three so far. The Secret Service has a no-fail mission. And I think we’ve uncovered a lot of shenanigans and wrong-doing. They really haven’t had any oversight in the last 15-plus years. Office of Personnel Management — we not only have a duty and responsibility there, but because we have authorization there, they fall within our jurisdiction, whereas Secret Service has more jurisdiction in Judiciary, but we provide the valuable oversight function.

So those are probably some of the top ones. But there’s some other juicy things coming up.

Examiner: Are you happy with the way the House leadership race has evolved?

Chaffetz: Yes. That’s part of the reason I was going to run, is that guys like Paul Ryan weren’t running. So as soon as he gave an indication that he might do it, I backed out. I think it’s important for our conference to have this fight, and I’m glad I did it, but I’m excited that Paul Ryan could become the speaker. I think he’d be great.